The 30-Year-Old Timeline Is A Total Lie | Just Getting Good

And so, for somebody 50 and 60 to meet,

because the other side of

that is men my age don't want women my age.

>> T.

>> >> But the love of goodness, okay?

They want women my daughter's age.

>> Hello everyone, and welcome back to an all new episode of Just Getting Good.

This week is kind of a fun one,

because one of the subjects

that we have not yet covered on this channel is the subject of personal

style,

especially as we get older.

We talk a lot about women feeling invisible past a certain age,

and we also talk a lot about not knowing how to dress once we

reach the age of,

let's say, 30 to 40.

In large part, because a lot of the clothes

that we see in stores

or the content that we see on social media is just frankly no longer

geared toward us,

not geared toward our bodies or our professional lives or our stage in life.

And for many of us, no longer understanding our own personal style,

no longer feeling like we can comfortably dress ourselves,

not even really understanding what beauty products work for us

as we get older

and what is or isn't worth investing in is part of what can lead

to that sense of invisibility,

like the world is no longer made for you.

And yet, for a lot of us,

personal style is one of the best ways to not only assert ourselves in

every room that we walk into,

but also to feel more like ourselves throughout every stage of life,

because a well-crafted wardrobe, among other things,

is the kind of thing that can stick with us for years,

if not decades, and help us feel more like the person

that we've always been

and the person that we are still becoming.

And in this series, we talk a lot about the positives of aging,

more confidence and a stronger sense of self.

And one of the best things you can do to ensure

that that future version of you is the fearless woman I'm sure you're imagining

is to start taking care of your finances now.

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My guest today, despite spending most of her career in the mental health space

and treating fashion and beauty

as a bit of a side hustle,

has now come into content creation in the fashion

and beauty spaces full-time sort of by accident

because,

as we'll discuss, she just was

so good at it

that she naturally developed a very large following.

But as someone who I think will be a perfect shepherd to talk about

defining our personal style

and understanding beauty as we get older,

whether you are someone who is looking to just create a capsule wardrobe

and stick with it

or to really experiment with more interesting,

unique, and in many cases, let's be clear,

second-hand/thrifted style as you get older

because I know a lot of us are wanting to be more conscientious not

just about what we buy

but about how we buy it.

Um and so I'm

so excited to sit down with her for a talk on all of those

things as well as some elements of her personal life

and story and how she got to being the sort of beauty/fashion maven

that she is today on Instagram

and elsewhere.

Without further ado, I am so excited to welcome my guest today, Selina Williams.

Wow.

>> That was amazing.

>> Oh.

>> Thank you.

>> Uh um thank you so much for joining.

So, for those who may not know, uh do you mind introducing yourself,

your name, your age, and what you do in life?

>> Sure.

Um Selina Williams.

Um many of people know me

as Selena Sincerely on Instagram

and on Tik Tok

and um My claim to fame is being a mom of three.

And then I moved over to uh Content creation

and uh that's where I'm kind of like landing right now.

So uh that's my that's my little spiel.

>> Amazing and you are uh and your age if you don't mind sharing.

>> I am 55 just turned 55 in March and so I did about that.

It's really a good time.

>> Well, I was going to say we usually start our conversations by asking

our guests at what age they felt

that life really started getting good for them.

So what would you say yours is?

>> I would I would say 50.

>> 50.

>> I felt like 50 was the beginning of a new dawn a new day.

It was just Um I was really in a good space

and I just felt like Um

That we were sold a bill of goods.

We were convinced that it was the beginning of the end

and then I realized

that this has been a lie we've been told

and 50 was like Okay,

I don't I don't feel any different.

I I feel good.

I I still look okay.

I can you know, so 50 for me was when I was like, okay,

I'm I felt like a grown-up.

>> >> Amazing and you were telling me um we were talking before we

started filming that you were just at your eldest daughter's wedding this past weekend.

>> Uh April 25th a couple weeks ago. >> ago.

Um and you mentioned that she is 35.

>> Yep.

>> Meaning that you had her at 20.

>> Yes.

>> Which is kind of I mean I think today would be kind of

a shockingly young age for someone to have a kid.

>> It's wild.

I I wouldn't recommend zero stars.

No.

>> >> Well, tell me a little bit about how you came to be

a mother at 20.

>> Um just you know,

her father and I met little little star cross star cross lovers

and um and you know,

just like the birds and the bees do kind of thing happened,

and um I always knew I wanted to be a mom,

and it wasn't I I just went with it, and I was it again,

it was such a different time.

Like, I had an apartment, we welcomed this baby home,

and you even though I felt like a grown-up at 50,

you just grew up.

Like, you brought this baby home, and you were a grown-up.

I just don't imagine anyone today at 20 doing that.

>> Well, yeah, I was going to say.

Especially in New York. 20 is I mean, my friend jokingly,

my friend who had her first child, she got pregnant at 29,

she jokes that it was a teen pregnancy for New York.

Because I mean, it's true.

Like, it is really >> really is true.

It really is true.

I mean, my baby at I mean, she's at my oldest,

but my baby at 35 is like is now on her husband's um cell

phone plan.

Like, like uh like, to be to plan meals, worry about health care,

worry about a kid getting to daycare.

Can you imagine First of all, the in this economy?

Like, absolutely not.

Absolutely not.

Absolutely not.

And so, for me though,

I one of the hardest parts of my life was

when my youngest got into like,

junior high school, and it dawned on me

that I didn't know who Selena was.

>> Yes.

>> Because I was always Ashley's mom, or Mark's mom, or Nicholas's mom.

I was somebody's mom.

And then when it's like, but what are you besides that?

And I didn't know.

And so, it it was it was a lot of self-discovery.

It was hard.

It was just a a transition for me because it's like, well,

what do you do now?

Not have another baby cuz that's crazy.

So, um so, it then I had to really, you know,

learn more about myself.

>> How old were you when you had your two other children?

>> So, I joke

that they're um the children are three only children

because I had the baby my daughter was 17

when I had my last kid.

>> Okay, so so it was 20, 37, and in the middle it was what?

>> Um 7 years apart.

So, she was 7

when the the next kid was born

and then and then 10 years later.

>> Okay, so 20, 27, and 37.

>> Yeah.

>> Tell me about having a child at 20 versus a child at 37.

>> At 37, you don't give a I don't know if you can curse.

You don't give a about anything.

I don't I mean,

I used to joke

that he was eating Oreos

and probably watching porn

because I have no idea.

I was exhausted.

>> >> I have no When I tell you exhausted,

but the first one it was like pureeing sweet potato

and like don't touch anything.

Shh, when she sleep.

This kid, I'm like vacuuming.

I don't know.

I don't even because you even

though I they're all mine

and the years are in between is great,

each kid got a different mother.

>> That's so right.

I'm 7 years older than my only sister and we're two only children.

We have two completely different mothers even today. >> 100% >> know that woman.

I'm like, your mother seems great.

>> >> I haven't met her, but she sounds amazing.

>> And it's so true because you you as I'm having children, I'm growing up.

>> Right, of course.

>> So, 17 years later to have a kid first of all,

I wasn't as neurotic.

>> Yeah.

>> So, that's a whole different thing and each kid got a different mother.

My kid, they got a very poor mother.

I was a kid.

I didn't know what I was doing.

And then the 30s, when I have this kid at 37,

and now this kid lives a very charmed life.

Like, he goes away to college

and he's he's in a band

and he's just,

you know, getting on the train and swiping and tapping.

He has no clue.

So, it's definitely each kid is like, "Who's that lady?"

>> Wow.

So, he's 18, the youngest.

19.

He just turned 19.

Okay.

Can you tell me about having a 35-year-old versus a 19-year-old currently?

>> Um so, the 35-year-old is a typical oldest daughter, firstborn,

as am I.

>> Same.

>> So, she is like the reason

that I had more is

because she completely tricked me.

She was like, literally the best kid ever.

I really had no problems.

And I remember when I first started working in mental health,

they a lot of the women warned me that, you know,

teenage girls are difficult.

You know, that they're very whatever.

I don't care, you know,

and and you and the they could have a very combative with the mom.

And I didn't have that with my daughter.

Um she's not an angel by any means, but she I didn't have that.

So, while I was so busy focusing on her,

making sure there was no trauma and teen pregnancy and all the scary things,

the other two were sneaking up the back, the two boys.

Um so, my middle son is an adrenaline junkie, anything that's fast, a motorcycle,

Hellcat, TRX truck, whatever.

I'm going I'm fast as fast as possible.

>> Yeah.

>> And Nicholas was like, he's the quintessential baby.

He's the sweetest.

He doesn't He's quiet.

He's like in college for music and acting and he's in a band.

Um so, surprisingly, he's in a band that they do this.

>> >> Like scream music?

>> Growling, yes.

>> Growling?

Wow. >> of that.

I was very I was shocked, too.

I was like, "Kid, you're I thought you were going to rap."

He's like, "No, I'm going to growl

and I'm going to play a guitar

and drums."

And so, he is but he's like the sweetest.

So, >> And talk to me about how relationships factored in to all three

of those children,

because I know that you had a long-term partner >> Yeah. >>

that you a few years ago tragically lost.

>> Yes.

>> Um can you talk to me a little bit about sort of meeting

that person a bit later in life?

>> So, um I was single for a

while and then I had done a little of the dating apps

and,

you know, that was very scarring and jarring.

Um and my daughter reminded me one day

that no one is going to knock on the door.

I'm like, "Uh yeah, they do.

UPS, FedEx, all of those people."

>> >> She's like, "No, it's not going to work."

So, um we gave that a bit and then I said,

"I can't do this anymore."

So, I'm just fine living life.

I'm starting to and it was it wasn't that long.

I met him 2021.

And I am starting to get invited to events,

more events in the creator space.

Um and so, there's an event that's going to happen.

It's in October and I kept manifesting in this little my journal,

I'm going to meet my husband, my husband is here, love is here,

all these good positive things you're supposed to be writing

and manifesting and um about.

And um the evening of the event,

um my son was my middle son was leaving for the Air Force

and I it was like the hardest day of my life

and I didn't want to go.

And my son is like, "You have to go.

Like, there this is what we wanted.

We wanted you to become, you know, get into this space.

So, I'm like, oh my god, I don't really want to go.

But, anyway, I secured my daughter and her now husband,

was her boyfriend at the time,

to drive me into Manhattan because my night eyes, okay?

>> I'm >> I get it.

>> They're terrible.

So, I'm going to go.

I'm not in the mood.

I get to this event and my husband is not at this event.

It is a lot of LGBTQ people there.

Love that for them, but my husband wasn't there.

So, it's a beautiful night in October in New York, if you know,

you know, and my daughter calls me and is like,

we're going to come pick you up.

We're going to get the car and pick you up.

And I say, no, I can walk.

I have the right shoes on.

The ladies, you know what I'm talking about,

if you have the right walking shoe in the city.

So, we start walking.

We're walking and as we walk, we walk past Catch Steak.

>> Mhm.

>> And we get to the end of the street

and as we get to the end of the street,

my daughter is holding my arm and she says, did you see him?

And I said, without turning, because ladies, you know, you don't don't look, okay?

And I said, I did.

And she said, we're going back.

And I was like, no, we're not.

I'm old.

We don't do that.

And she said, well, we're going to do it today.

And so, she turns me around

and we walk back in front of Catch Steak

and he is there

and another gentleman are standing outside.

And my daughter says, excuse me, gentlemen, she says, are you married?

And he says and puts his And I'm shocked, okay?

As you I never shut up.

I am speechless.

He shakes his head, no, and she says,

is there anyone that thinks they're married to you?

>> Nope.

>> And he's he puts up his hand and he says, no.

And she says, okay, well, this is my mom.

Can she have your number?

And he is like, okay.

>> >> So, she takes my phone, hands it to him.

She says, can you put your phone number in?"

He does.

She says, "Thank you so much.

I won't be on the date."

And then she takes me and swings me around.

I haven't like said a word.

We walk to the end of the street.

We're laughing.

It's so funny.

The next day I get home.

The next day I'm I'm at work

and before I get off work I call my daughter

and I'm like,

"He didn't call me."

And she's like, "He how would he?

He doesn't have your number."

And I'm like, "What?"

And she says >> had his.

>> I said, "Oh my god, what should I do?

Should I text him?"

And she's like, "Oh my god, you guys are old.

Just call him."

And so I call him

and he said he didn't think I was going to call

and we talked for about an hour

and then went on a date 3 days later

and we're together ever ever since.

>> Wow.

And so how old were you when you met him?

>> I was I met him 2021

so I was I just turned 50

that March.

And it was October I met him and he was 61.

And he was never married, had no children.

He was a unicorn.

>> Wow.

>> And which was interesting because when I tell people I have three children,

people are like, "Oh okay, you know, they're older."

And I'm like, "No, when I tell you I have three children,

I have three children every sense of the word. 24 hours a day,

7 days a week.

They call all the time, all hours.

I see them all the time.

And sometimes daily.

I have children.

And so for someone who doesn't have children, I was like,

"This is going to be This might be a little bit hard."

But he was just the sweetest.

I tell my daughter

if she was younger I would have bought her a pony.

Cuz he was the best thing.

He really was the best thing that happened to me.

And I was so happy and um unfortunately uh February 14th, 2024,

he worked in a restaurant in Manhattan called Brooklyn Chophouse.

He was a concierge there from the day they opened

and they loved him

and it was on 40 It's on 47th

and he was like the mayor of 47th,

everyone knew him.

The restaurants, the the theaters, and um he went to work on Valentine's Day.

It was a special night, you know,

and I'm home and we talk a little bit.

He worked at 4:00 to midnight and we talked and he said,

"I'll see me, you know, when he gets home."

And uh I'm usually asleep very early.

It was about 11:00

and for some reason there I got an alert on my phone.

A young lady had commented on our engagement video on Instagram.

And she said, "Selena, call me." with her phone number.

I don't didn't know who she was.

It is about 11:00 at night.

Um I called out the number and a young lady answers and she's screaming.

And she says "Eddie's down and they're taking him to the hospital."

So I rallied the troops, my children, and like a convoy,

my middle son shows up and my daughter and her fiance and baby,

we all are riding in at this point.

I lived in Rockland County.

And so we have to get into Manhattan.

They're taking him to Mount Sinai.

And the whole ride I am praying and I'm not going to lie,

I offered a lot of people up to God.

There's a couple people you can take.

I can write them down.

I don't know.

Do you need them in alphabetical order?

I can give you a few names.

Um and all the things I would do.

A kidney, a lung, a blood.

I I don't care.

Um and then we get a call from I get a call from the

police.

And the police are like, "Are you close?"

And I'm like, that's not good.

So, we get to the hospital and when we get there,

you get the "I'm so sorry."

>> From the doctors?

>> Yeah.

>> Um was it a heart attack?

>> Yeah.

And he was the thing

that was so shocking is

that the doctor came in

and said that they were going to do an autopsy

because he they thought he was in his 40s.

He worked out every day.

>> Yeah.

>> He didn't smoke.

Didn't drink.

He had his oatmeal in the morning

and he was like a physical specimen

that was absolutely fabulous.

And he just looked like he was asleep.

And I remember leaving.

One thing about New York, New York doesn't play.

The police were lovely, but they were like,

"You know his car is outside the restaurant.

They're going to tow that car."

So, we all take his little belongings

and drive back to the restaurant

and it is now I always say he's a gentleman to the end.

He passed away on the 15th,

not on Valentine's Day cuz he was a gentleman and a scholar.

And we get to the restaurant

and the young lady

that did CPR on him waited in her little pink you know,

Valentine's dress and she said she was so sorry.

And and I said, "You know, he wasn't alone and I'm so grateful."

And I remember driving home and thinking,

like it it did it's it took forever to sink in

that it was real.

>> Yeah.

>> It just and so when you have children don't recommend zero stars.

When you have children >> >> you don't really get the opportunity to mourn

like you want to

because your children are doing the are we okay?

Like Look, is that lady okay?

Like >> Yeah.

>> Like your mother's crying again.

Like what and so I have to you know,

let me get let's get my let's get it together.

Now I have to send him home

and do all the things

and deal with his family

and one thing you need to know is

that when you are not married to somebody,

you are nobody.

>> Yeah.

>> So I have to call your sister and I your sister's very kind.

Everyone's very kind.

But it's just you have no you're nobody.

I was nobody to him.

And so I did the funeral and and am concerned about my daughter.

Because my daughter did this.

She you know, brought me this joy that was like immeasurable.

I can't even there's nothing I can do to thank her for what she's

done for me.

But the other side of that is that I I felt like eviscerated.

Like physically I felt like a shell.

I just like like you're floating around.

Um And so it was probably one of the it was one of the

hardest times of my life.

>> Yeah.

>> And and I've been honest with them

and people and and I don't know

if I would be here

if my children weren't out here.

Because my anger with God was immeasurable.

Because my thought process was why did you bother me?

Why did you bother me?

Why did you show me how good it could get

and be like that's just enough for you.

You can't have any more.

And I was so The anger is probably what kept me going.

>> Yeah.

Cuz I'm pissed off.

>> Yeah.

>> Like all the frogs I kissed,

you finally give me a prince and you're like psych, girl.

You're going to get that for a couple minutes.

>> I was like I know the name is very common, Selena Williams, Serena.

So it's very close, but please, I'm exhausted.

>> Yeah.

Um I'm so angry for you.

>> Right, girl.

>> It's so unfair.

>> And you don't want to be

that corny and be like this is not fair.

But it's Please, there's a lot of people you could have picked on.

But I have to just say this and this is not a plug.

So last year, I always had problems with my legs,

always had problems with my leg, my right leg.

I had venous closure, which a lot of you don't know what that is.

It's the same as like vein stripping 100 years ago.

We don't do that anymore.

I've always had problems.

Something's wrong, something's wrong.

Pre-Nuvo, I was lucky to get that full body scan.

>> Okay.

>> Get that full body scan.

I go to the doctor regularly, get the scan.

They're like this looks good, this looks good.

When you have those scans, after the scan, you speak to a doctor.

The doctor come you do a zoom.

The doctor contacts me and he says, "Listen,

you have a lot of plaque in your arteries."

And I'm like, "No, that's not true."

And he's like, "No, I'm telling you you do.

You need to get to your doctor."

Call my doctor.

My doctor's like, "No, that's not true.

They just do that to scare you."

And I was like, "Well, let me just come in, okay?

I go in, we do the test on a Thursday,

Saturday morning he calls me.

He's like, you need statins immediately.

Like, it saved my life.

You have to get checked.

>> You have to get checked.

Go to the doctor.

>> Like, please.

I know >> can, I know it's hard for insurance

and cost and >> all of

that,

but you know what's expensive?

A funeral.

And I remember when I met him

and I started sharing him on my socials.

Um, I'll never forget one of the things that's there.

It's still there to this day.

I don't know if it was our engagement video

or cuz we did one of those corny like,

you know, with the hand thing with the outfits.

It was very cute.

Um, it's got like 10 million views.

Oh my god.

Insane.

And someone, of all the comments, of all the world, someone said,

"This gives me hope.

God didn't forget about me."

Because it goes back to what you started all this about,

not this maudlin thing, was that when we get to a certain age,

we're invisible.

>> Yeah.

>> And so for somebody 50 and 60 to meet,

because the other side of

that is men my age don't want women my age.

>> T.

>> >> But the love of goodness, okay?

They want women my daughter's age.

So, to meet someone

that was my age

and who was lovely

and just amazing was

so inspiring for so many people >> Yeah. >>

that the women were like,

yes.

And when he died, it was so devastating to so many people.

And the comments are still there.

When he passed away from all over the world, >> Yeah. >> people were like,

I can't no.

Like, please no.

I'm like, child, me too.

No.

I don't understand.

Like, no, please is right.

Insane.

>> So, I mean, you mentioned feeling so like angry with God,

which I I feel angry with God on your behalf.

I'm like that's so unfair.

But you don't regret it.

>> No.

>> No.

>> And And I've said it publicly

and I'll say it again

that even knowing the outcome,

I would do it again.

>> You spent your whole career more or less in mental health.

Do you think that that made you better prepared for the grieving process?

>> No.

>> Not at all.

>> Not one thing.

>> Really?

>> one thing that can prepare you for the loss of your heart.

>> Yeah.

Do you feel like going through such acute grief yourself change the way you

look at mental health treatment

and working with people who are struggling with mental health?

>> 100%.

>> How so?

>> Because so culturally getting help is still a problem.

>> Yeah.

>> And I think

that me going through this One of the biggest things is

when I would talk about it

or I still talk about it is people say,

"Are you in therapy?

I hope you go to therapy.

I hope you talk to someone."

And I think that the value of therapy um I've might taken a kid

to therapy at go to therapy.

My daughter and her husband now have gone to counseling.

I I think that it is the most important thing

that you can do for your own well-being.

Because talking to a friend is talking to a friend.

>> Yeah.

>> Talking to a family member is not going to help

because they are enmeshed in their own truth.

And that may shade what your truth is to them

because they still have I I always say to my family

that the elders manufactured a reality to make them feel better.

>> Mhm, say more about that.

>> Because if I say to you, you know,

when I was going up the sky was purple

and they're like and

and it was because you were smoking in the house

and they're like that's not true.

>> Yeah.

>> Because then you have to look at yourself and be like, yeah,

I did smoke in the house.

So they manufacture a reality

that makes them feel better whether it's to the detriment of you.

And so my mother is not like that.

So I'm very lucky.

If I say to Wendy, what happened XYZ, she'll be like, well,

this is what happened.

And so for me I remember

when my daughter was growing up um her high school graduating class,

I think there was six young ladies that were pregnant.

And I remember one of them said to me,

what did you tell Ashley so that didn't happen to her?

And I said the truth.

>> Yeah.

>> And so for me,

I've always spoken truth to my children whether that's hard or not.

And we joke about how one time this is going way back,

my daughter loved a little Barney.

>> Okay.

Listen, many many of us >> to you had to go to the store

and buy a VHS tape

if you wanted to see Barney except

when it was on.

I remember walking in the mall and my daughter's like,

I want to get a tape.

I said you can't get a tape this time.

She's like, what do you mean?

And I said we don't She's like six

and I said we don't have the money right now.

She said take one of those cards out of your bag.

Oh, honey, let me tell you about those cards.

>> Yeah.

>> Because you have to tell the truth.

So when my daughter turned 16 or when my son turned 16,

you knew that just because you watched MTV my super sweet 16,

a helicopter wasn't coming to drop you down in front of a Range Rover

because you knew who I was your whole life.

So I felt like we didn't tell children the truth

and we didn't get them help

if you needed help.

My son Nicholas is on the spectrum.

Was it hard for me to admit?

100% cuz I had two regular kids.

So when he's born

and he's not speaking at like 2 years old

and he's just like What do you want?

And he's like, I'm standing in the kitchen, lady.

Like you see what I'm And he's teaching himself Arabic and he's, you know,

doing puzzles at 3 years old

and school calls when he's like 4

and 1/2 and pre-K

and she's like,

we need to talk

because we showed all these kids a stop sign

and we asked Nicholas what it was

and he said it's an octagon.

I had to get him into early intervention and get him services.

His IQ was off the charts, but he wasn't regular.

So I had to get help for him

and in turn get help for myself

because I didn't do anything.

But I blamed myself because I made these two regular kids.

What did I do to this kid?

And so getting help for yourself is one of the most important things you

can do.

I I think everyone needs it at some point in life you might need

it and you should do it.

>> Going back to um what you talk what we were talking about earlier

um with regards to feeling invisible um you know,

you were working in mental health your whole career

and you started doing the fashion

and beauty stuff really

as kind of a hobby

as your own personal thing.

What did personal style do for you at the time

when it wasn't your full-time focus?

>> It was an outlet.

>> Yeah.

>> It you know, people have hobbies of painting and you know,

music and for me fashion has been a way to express myself even

when um there is no money,

you can express yourself with fashion.

When you mentioned about thrifting, when you mentioned about putting pieces together,

it it's an expression of you

and that it doesn't matter

if we have the same pieces on,

it is totally unique to you how you put them together.

And I just found that it was an outlet for me.

Always.

>> Now, is that something that you had a passion for your entire life,

or did it develop as you got older?

>> My entire life.

>> Your entire life, okay.

Now, at what point in your life did it start to feel like, oh,

actually maybe this is what I should be doing full-time?

>> I never thought I should do it full-time until Eddie died.

>> Tell me more.

>> So, I at the end of it,

I despised my the people at my job.

Because I always say, it's never the job.

>> Yeah, it's the people. >> job.

And so, I worked there forever and I loved it, and unfortunately,

by the time I left, mental health had been decimated.

You know, there's no money, the funds and this,

and so the programs are dwindling

and it's just a mess

and it's just I'm not happy there,

but I had to be 55 and 25 to get my pension.

So, now it's 23 years and I'm 53.

And I'm going to Eddie is like, you have to hold on.

Just hold on.

And he's we're from that that generation.

That's a good job, Savannah, you know?

You get a pension, a pension?

Is this a god dream?

Okay, so >> >> That's true.

>> When I love the fact that children, like my chil- people my children's age,

like young people like you, you to stay in a job 23 years?

>> Impossible.

>> The nerve.

Who would do that?

The audacity.

So, I'm at this job and he's like, just listen,

it's like less than 2 years.

You can do it.

Don't worry.

It's going to be good.

At this point, I'm getting campaigns.

I'm doing, you know, getting a little recognition on social media.

I'm I'm very excited.

I'm very happy.

I'm going to things.

Somebody paying me to put on a dress.

I'm like, this is amazing.

And this job is working my nerves.

So, I Eddie dies February 15th.

Um I plan this funeral.

I know I have to go back to work.

I was invited by a company called Rebel Nell in Detroit

that are the sweetest people in the whole wide world before Eddie passed.

I was going to go to Detroit because apparently Detroit has a happening nightlife.

Um but I'm going to speak on a panel for um women's month.

It is March.

Going to be March 2nd is my birthday.

We're going to go there.

He's going to come with me.

I'm going to speak on this panel.

I'm going to celebrate my birthday.

We get he passes away.

They contact me and they're like, absolutely don't come.

You do not have to come.

I'm fine.

I can go.

So, I get on a plane.

As I land into Detroit, a young lady um TSA worker is like,

I'm so sorry.

I'm so sorry about it.

And it was a that moment that I'm like,

people are starting to recognize me.

>> Oh, I was going to say, how the hell did she know?

But from social media.

Oh my god.

>> Because the time that now I get engaged to Eddie, we are together,

I have like 200 something thousand followers.

This is amazing.

Eddie dies, I get 200,000 more.

>> Which is a very bittersweet reason to double your following.

>> So, I land there.

Um I get into this hotel

and the people there are

so lovely and I remember my mommy calling me

and she's like,

you know, how are you?

And I'm like, so okay.

She's like, did you bring anything of his, like a picture or a tie?

I'm like, so I can hang myself, Wendy?

Calm down.

>> >> Let's focus, OKAY?

I'M HANGING ON BY A THREAD.

I'm here for a job.

Okay, I get it.

>> >> So, I'm there I'm I'm there I my cousin FaceTimes me a whole dinner.

We she sits and looking at me

while I'm eating a whole dinner is to keep me together in Detroit without

my my children or support

and it's time for me to go home

and a friend of mine calls,

he lives in Miami and he FaceTimes me.

He says, I just was calling to see how you are

and he sees me

and he's like,

well, I see it's not very well.

Not good.

He says, you going back to work?

And I said, yeah.

He says, when?

I said, the 7th and he's like, why?

What?

I said, cuz I have to go to work.

>> Yeah.

>> And he's like, why?

I said, well, I have to pay my health benefits,

I have to do all this and he's like,

you can't make enough money doing social media?

And I was like, I said, I don't I don't know.

And he's like, well,

maybe think about how much you are have to spend

and what you can make

and and I said,

I don't think I can do that.

And he's like, so you're going to let a few a few thousand dollars

keep you from a million?

I got to call you back.

So, I do all these calculations, what I would have to make,

what I would have to hustle,

what kidney and I pick up the phone

and call my HR

and I say,

do I have to give two weeks notice?

And she said, nope, it's a courtesy.

And I said, I'm not feeling courteous.

>> Oh.

>> And I got on the plane

and came home and told my children

and my children were

so happy.

>> Good.

Now, from a financial perspective, does that mean you forfeited your entire pension?

>> Nope, just part of it.

You didn't like all of the math.

>> None of it.

None of it.

>> So, what happened is now I have to call my parents.

Do you know how old I am?

And I got to call my mommy and daddy.

And Wendy I said, "I just want to let you know I'm quitting."

I said, "Why are you gasping?

Please, okay?"

>> I dealt with enough.

>> I said "You know I can get my pension when I turn 55."

>> Yeah.

>> They can't hold me hostage.

>> No.

>> The only issue was I had to pay my health benefits from the

day I left to the day I retired

so that I would be vested

and then they would pay it for the rest of my life.

>> Got it.

Okay.

>> Which was $1,400 a month.

>> Jesus.

>> I didn't pay anything else.

I haven't paid rent, car, eaten,

nothing. $1,400 off the top was the the thought

that I had to make sure

that I did.

And so, that morning I got up, March 7th,

and I had Sorry about the water.

I had chat write me a resignation letter.

>> >> Sorry about the water.

>> Very Gen Z of you.

>> Yes, I Yes, I did.

I was very proud of myself.

And I'm driving the 7 minutes to my job.

That's how close.

And the whole time I'm talking to Eddie in the car and God.

God, I was like,

"You're a second cuz you know you don't piss me off."

Eddie, I'm like, "I hope you got me

because I'm about to quit this job."

>> Yeah.

>> And I walked in

and my the second in command was It was literally like Newman.

>> >> God.

>> Selena, I was like, "Janet."

She's like, "Welcome back."

And I'm like >> >> And I said, "And goodbye."

>> And goodbye.

>> And handed her that letter of resignation.

It was like a It was cinematic.

>> Yes.

>> Shocking.

>> You did it.

>> I was sweating.

>> Yeah.

>> But I It was I was like before they went crazy,

I was like I can put on a red shirt and khakis.

I'll work in Target.

I have no shame.

I've worked in supermarkets.

I have no pride.

If I have to pay bills,

I'm going to do what I have to do.

So, it was that moment in

that hotel room when my friend said

that and the fact

that Eddie worked to the day he died.

>> Died at work.

>> Yeah.

And we've been sold so much about wait till you retire.

It is so wonderful and you don't get to retire.

He didn't get to retire.

>> No.

>> And I was like, why am I giving these another day?

I I can't.

I I'm going to end up in jail.

Like I really was

because I was so miserable at the job

because what happens when you start doing social media

and you get some traction on social media,

your job is the biggest up.

They're the They're pieces of >> Oh,

I dealt with this when I started this company,

so I'm right there with you.

>> I'll never forget I went to an event for a Flowerbomb fragrance.

It was at 8:00 in the morning to hear Wale.

Who should have to be subjected to that?

I don't know.

>> As an as a DC girl, um you know,

I have to defend >> like at the crack of dawn at like the summit.

We were there at 8:00 in the morning listening to him

and getting our perfume.

And I go to work.

Like show up to work at 10:00, took some time off.

Like 3 days later my boss called me in with another coworker who's like

this.

Because my boss had been blocked.

>> Hell yeah.

>> The other coworker saw and told.

It's come to my attention

that you were at a very highly publicized event

and you used 2 hours of sick.

I'm going to give you the opportunity.

I'll never forget this conversation to change it to vacation.

I said, "Okay."

This didn't have to be a grand thing.

So now you're looking

and like it was just miserable situation

and you know how it goes.

So now it's like now you want me to choose.

Well, I've chosen.

>> Good for you.

Do you feel like do you feel looking back that Eddie gave you that?

>> Yes.

I say he had to leave for me to be free.

>> It's a crazy trade-off, but >> wouldn't have left.

>> Yeah.

>> Because he was the type like me, like my parents,

like how we were raised.

You don't you quit?

>> No.

You just don't do it.

>> No.

>> So >> >> you're you know, now in this position.

So that was in March of 2024.

>> Yes.

>> And you've been full-time with beauty and fashion ever since.

>> Yes.

>> Now, I'm interested because in kind of the story of your life,

a lot of things happened for you later than we think

that they happened for women.

>> Yeah.

>> You know?

Um and I can totally understand why your love story did feel

so inspiring and so like this is you know,

I don't have to view things a certain way or expect certain things.

Um but similarly, you know,

you enter in in your early 50s to probably the most ageist industry.

On top of, you know, being racist and having tons of issues of,

you know, being a certain size.

I mean, name a a prejudice.

>> It's there.

>> They're at the the vanguard of those um prejudices.

>> >> Specifically entering into beauty and fashion full-time as a woman over 50,

can you just talk about the experience of that?

Like how your how it feels to move through such an ageist industry at

your age?

>> So, in the beginning it it was it's getting better.

It is not where it should be at all, but it's definitely getting better.

And I think that the the reason

that it's getting better is

that the beauty industry,

which is one of the biggest industries,

has woke up to the fact that it is not just you know,

Bonnie Bell and Estee Lauder.

>> Right.

>> That in between there is a whole group cohort of women of individuals

that still feel good,

still look good, and have money.

>> Yeah. >> that and and to be honest with you,

I don't think they give a about us, the old people.

I think they know we have money.

>> That is very true.

And our disproportionately supporting the luxury industries.

>> 100% But the thing about it is is that again,

I I talked to the younger people in the fact

that they are much smarter in

so many aspects is

that we were not vocal about the things

that we do or the

or taking care of ourselves,

that we were supposed to just fade quietly into the night.

And I remember doing um a video and I love a little cleavage, okay?

I love that for me.

>> Um and for me >> And I What What's the problem?

And I had a breast lift and reduction at like 52 years old.

>> Love it.

>> For me, okay?

And because I had three children, breastfed, they were terrible,

it was a lost cause.

I wanted it for me.

I had no desire I wasn't going to speak about it

because it wasn't a secret,

but I went to have it done right here Madison Avenue,

and did content like a week later.

And he was fantastic, Dr.

Singh.

Like, my god.

Um and people were like, "What are you What are you wearing?

What kind of bra is that?

What's going on there?"

And I was like to my daughter,

"I think I have to talk about it."

And there's a getting to what we're talking about.

And so, I started talking about it, and women were DMing me like,

"I can't believe you did that.

I want to do that.

I Why did you I I would never think I didn't I thought I

was too old."

And I think what has happened is we have given each other permission.

>> Yeah.

>> And that is what is kind of turning the tide,

that if you want to go I remember 4 years ago, no,

before I met Eddie, 6 years ago, a a brand contacted me,

wanted to give me Botox.

I'd never had Botox, not averse, but I wasn't going to pay for it.

They offered me Botox, got the Botox, they ran the ad, the comments,

"Why would you do that?

You ruined your face.

Why can't you just age gracefully?

Why can't you" And my response was,

"If you see me on a treadmill or walking, you never say,

'Why can't you age gracefully?'

Why is it that if I do something aesthetically, it bothers you?"

And so, when women start giving each other permission,

because I know we say we do it for ourselves,

we do it for the male gaze, we don't.

We do it We do it so when you're walking down the street,

somebody's like, "That You look fan-fucking-tastic."

That's what we do it for, and for ourselves.

>> So, when I started doing things for myself

and seeing other women my age letting their hair gray,

or going to get the Botox, or wearing a red lip,

or or working out, or getting a breast lift, or getting a tummy tuck,

or getting whatever that thing is

when they put it on your butt

and it does like a hundred scrunches in 10 seconds,

doing all of those things, it's giving us permission.

And so, brands are like, "Oh, wait,

they're not on you know

When I saw that the Golden Girls were supposed to be my age >>

I'm starting to see I'm 37.

I'm starting to see some of these ages of what like the character was

supposed to be in these movies

and I'm like I not me being older than Steve Martin in Parenthood.

>> Can you even stand it?

>> be fair, he's looked 40 since he was 20, but >> my entire life.

Like Morgan Freeman, I never saw him young.

>> They've never been young.

They've never been young.

>> But the Golden Girls,

everyone that lived in this house together with the lanai

and their shoulder pads

and cheesecake were in their 50s.

Are you okay?

>> No, I know.

Well, I want to run something by you actually cuz I've been thinking about

this a lot as it pertains to less even about beauty

and more about personal style

because I think I think there's I think there's a few things happening.

I think A, there's often a conflation with just wanting to look young

and I don't think at all

that that is what needs to be implied by beauty

or fashion or any of those things.

>> Um that being said, I think that there's um for me,

I think that one of the things

that really just kind of bums me out about this invisibility

that a lot of women experience

as they get older

and this feeling that the kind of the world isn't built for them,

not interested in them is I think a lot of it is very wrapped

up in women sort of reaching a point where they're no longer in their

bodies.

I think a lot of it is wrapped up in sexuality as well.

Like there's a feeling of I am just this is a whole side of

myself where like you said,

you walk down the street,

maybe you just put on a red lip

or you put on a cute outfit

or you just you have this sense

that you are very much embodied in the world

and interacting with it in real time

that you're um that there is something there for you

and that you who bringing something into the world

and I think that for not everyone,

it doesn't have to manifest in, you know, really taking care in your appearance,

but I think so often we feed women this narrative

that especially after a certain age

and particularly after they have children,

that it's sort of like we're no longer interested.

Go away.

>> 100% >> Disappear.

And I think for the women,

whether it's some of the women we've interviewed on this show

or women that I know in my own life who are,

you know, 40s, 50s,

and beyond who really bring a strong presence into the room.

Generally speaking, these are also women who are living a very sensual life.

That doesn't always necessarily mean sex, but often it does,

but it also means like they're they're eating good food.

They're having traveling, having interesting experiences, making new friends.

I was just having a cocktail party the other day

and this woman was telling me,

and she's in her mid-50s, she was like,

"I just had I fell in platonic love this weekend with a woman I

met when I was having a drink by myself at a bar,

and I ended up in a 3-hour conversation with this fabulous 60-something woman,

and we just, you know, we ended up spending the night together,

and I just I'm, you know, obsessed with her."

And I think that that sort of, and again,

it doesn't always have to come with how we present ourselves,

but I do think it's heavily linked to this feeling of invisibility is

that we're just no longer of our bodies

or of the world.

>> Well, I 100%

and I think that the problem is is

that we have been convinced

that we are valueless

when we can no longer have children.

>> Yes.

>> That is that has been our goal,

and then the fact

that the conversation around menopause has been

so verbal over the last few years is very important

because the menopause part of female life is devastating.

It doesn't matter when you talk to someone, it's like, "Oh, me,

I just had a little a little sweat here.

I didn't it didn't bother me.

I don't even It is absolutely devastating and debilitating.

And it changes your whole perspective on life.

It changes how you view yourself.

It changes how you think the world views you.

And I think that

that is probably one of the biggest issues is

that as we get older,

we were basically told to just sit on the porch in a rocking chair.

And because the last 10 to 15 years, it may have been longer,

but I'm noticing now cuz I'm in it,

we have come to the realization

that it was like a a silent clock stopped,

but the clock has not stopped.

And when I would put on certain things

and you'll you'll see comments on social media,

somebody put something on and be like, "Oh my god,

you're too old for that."

The clothes in my closet don't disintegrate.

Where do those What am I supposed to do with them?

So, I'm not supposed to wear them because biologically you don't like it.

And I think that

because women now of a certain age are like you said,

"I'm going to go out and I'm going to have a platonic love affair."

I met my now best friend the same year Eddie died.

>> Mhm.

>> And I tell her all the time he sent her.

She is married.

She has a wonderful husband.

She lives in Alabama.

And we met at an event, fell in love,

and now she is like my best friend.

She she really saved me

because I can sit

and commiserate with her

and whine and she'll be like,

"Friend, go take a nap."

And then she knows I got to get up tomorrow

and I got to be these kids' mom.

>> Yeah.

>> But I can have a conversation with her and be like,

"I'm so After the wedding, I moved in December.

I moved to a new new place after 20 years.

I moved from that unit up to the 17th floor to a a fabulous

unit.

I sent the baby to his first year of college.

My daughter was getting married.

My daughter got married and all of that left me with quiet.

>> Yeah.

>> And I was up for like 2 weeks.

>> You know, I'm I'm curious

as someone you just mentioned something

that I think is

so worth hitting on,

which is like my clothes don't just disintegrate

because I'm no longer the age you think I should be

when I wear them.

And I think that that really speaks to something.

I mean, now listen,

a huge part of the reason that clothes are no longer meant I mean,

clothes are just shitty now in terms of quality

and production a lot of them.

So, a lot of them just can't stand the test of time the way

the way clothes used to,

which is by the way all the more reason to shop vintage, second hand,

etc. cuz just the construction of some of these basic department store pieces,

it's night and day to what you get now.

>> Exactly.

>> Um but I do think there's something there,

which is that I think there's also this feeling, especially with social media,

where you see trends changing

so quickly and things feel like they cycle in

and out of being,

um you know, cuter of a moment or whatever within, I mean,

literally months at this point.

>> 100%.

>> There's this feeling of why even bother constructing this sort of really intentional

wardrobe if I'm not going to be able to wear it past a certain

time.

Um and so I'm interested for for you,

how you sort of conceptualize style

that travels with you throughout just all these different stages of your life

and that still feel good

when you put them on.

>> So, for me, I've always I've never concerned I know somebody will say, "Oh,

you're you're not that big."

That's probably a thing.

I've never concerned myself with a size number.

>> Mhm.

>> >> That I don't care about.

I also knew the difference between shopping in a junior store and a misses.

That's when I'm showing my age.

So, a lot of people didn't know the difference.

So, you go into a store

that would just to give you a to give you actual visualization.

It's Forever 21.

Forever 21 is juniors.

There's nothing I can do in there

because I am hippy

and curvy and I'm a a woman.

So, then you would go to a misses per se like a Ann Taylor,

okay?

So, that's where there's the difference.

So, one of the things

that I always have done is shopped for what I feel good in.

And so, I think that I don't concern yourself with a trend.

I've never cons- concerned myself with that.

I think that you can pull a piece from a trend.

If what's happening now is polka dots and you want to be in,

this dress I've had for several years, you get a polka dot scarf.

You don't have to immerse yourself into everything.

And there's a a a young person that I follow,

his name is Say Nico,

and he is amazing cuz he goes into your closet

and pulls out like 15,

16 outfits of things you wouldn't put together.

It's okay to ask for help.

It's okay to and it's okay to be like,

I only like to wear pantsuits.

You can then wear your pantsuits.

But, just be comfortable.

Don't conform.

So, that's what I've never done.

And I remember many, many years ago, I used to take the bus.

I didn't have money.

My daughter was little.

And I'll never forget the bus driver said to me,

I thought you had a twin because every time you get on the bus,

you're you dress so differently.

I never know what you're going to wear because I dress for my mood.

>> Oh, okay.

>> So, if I'm feeling you know, I'm feeling a little sexy,

a little cleavage day, you're going to get a little cleavage day.

If I'm feeling like a moo moo day,

you're going to get a moo-moo

and you're going to you're going to love it. >> going to you get

what you get and you don't get upset. >> like

and you and get upset.

Please.

Please, tell it to your therapist.

This is the point of this.

But, I think that people want to be because everything is so Instagrammable,

you're more concerned about the visuals as opposed to your comfort.

And that's the one thing about getting older that's the best thing cuz after

a while you don't give a >> Yeah.

Which is powerful.

>> One that's the best thing.

That's the best thing.

And find things that work for you.

And I remember again, I'm showing my age.

There was a Mel's Diner.

>> Okay.

>> And there was a character named Flo

and Flo used to wear her hair like up teased up

and like this blue eye shadow crazy

and it was always a joke.

And I think what happens is people get stuck in a style where they

felt the best.

So, it's not she doesn't know how to do anything different.

That's when she felt her best.

So, the point is you can translate

that blue eye shadow

and big hair to 2026

and still be yourself.

You don't have to completely conform.

So, when there was the discourse

or a part middle part

and it's and a middle >> I know it's side part.

>> WEAR WHATEVER PART makes you >> I just yeah.

>> So insane.

It's so >> the on TikTok I never experienced this until I started posting

on TikTok where it's everyone's

so young.

Instagram we're old as dirt over there now for social media years.

Um it's like a Instagram Reels is like a nursing home half the time.

Love and light.

I'm part of that demographic,

but TikTok they're young

as hell and they are on your ass

if they think they're doing something

that ages you.

They are so like people constantly will will comment on certain things about you

know,

you're you're dressing so old.

You're you know, your side part is so old.

Like all that.

And I'm like, okay, first of all, I am damn near 40 years old.

Let me be damn >> be.

Okay.

>> Let me be damn near 40 years old. >> hair on my head

cuz everybody's supposed to use minoxidil,

all the things.

Okay, so let me be glad I have the hair.

I remember when I got my teeth done

and I was so proud of myself

because it was the most expensive thing ever.

It's probably like a G Wagon in here.

Um and I hated them and I did it for me.

I hated them my whole life.

I got braces for all three kids.

Took care of all three kids.

That's what happens.

Don't recommend children.

Um because you take care of them first.

And then I got braces at 40.

It still didn't work.

And then I was like,

I'm going to get my teeth done before my daughter's wedding.

I want to do this.

And I remember getting them done

and the dental place posted it after asked me,

of course.

And like 99.9% of the people are good in the comments on on TikTok.

I'm so glad you finally got that done.

I was waiting for you >> Oh my god.

Did you see that woman who did

that like social experiment on a TikTok where she said

that she got all this stuff done

and everyone was like you look worse,

like you you ruined your face,

like all this And then and then a week later she was like,

I got nothing done, just so you know.

I just slightly changed the lighting in my makeup.

But you guys were waiting to tell me >> I mean the amount of

unsolicited >> It's crazy.

It's crazy and it's it's interesting, too,

because you really see in the in the reactions

that people will give

that there truly is no winning for women.

There's no winning because

if you go on the page of a woman who looks,

let's say she's in her 30s and she has visible wrinkles.

That's all the comments will be about is the fact that she looks old.

People will go in there

and this is when I want to I literally want to email their employers

and be like,

look what your crazy ass employee is doing.

But like they will post pictures of themselves and be like,

I'm younger than you and look at me.

>> Right. >> like, okay, but you're so wrong.

>> My mom is

so much older than you

and she looks way better than you.

I put a video on YouTube about totally unrelated to anything visual

and the people's comments my the love of my life now,

Tanja, she and I are in New Orleans

and she opens it up

and she's like I'm like,

what's the matter?

She's in tears.

The comments about me were >> >> What were they saying?

>> You are you're you're such a narcissist.

I could see from the beginning.

Oh, you're a piece of You you should be ashamed of yourself.

If I was your friend, I wouldn't even talk to you either.

Why would she be jealous of you?

I mean, to I I prefer my women with real teeth.

I mean >> Just stop.

>> It was wild and my first response was I was activated.

And then I was like >> No, no.

>> Wait.

What?

Block, block, block because you were on YouTube since 2011 with one subscriber

and this is your life's work.

>> Yeah.

>> Like to the point that I had started ending my videos and be like,

please, I'm trying to keep my edges.

Everybody focus on the video.

>> Yeah.

>> Not Selena, not my appearance.

Focus on the topic.

I'm talking about, you know, being an empty nester and you're like, yeah,

I hate your apartment.

>> Yeah. >> how much that sweater cost?

I'm like, >> >> wait, what?

Like, people are wild.

Social media, it is not for the faint of heart.

You have to have a thick skin.

>> Tell me about what specifically during, let's say,

2024 when you're going through immense grief,

but you're also completely changing your career >> Yeah.

>> And just like re- sort of rebooting your life at this time your

your youngest son is still in home in high school.

>> Yeah.

>> What did personal style mean for you at that time?

How did it factor into that year of your life in particular?

>> I I really used it to do like Billy Crystal, you look better,

you feel better.

>> Like fake it till you make it type.

>> I had no choice.

>> Did it work?

>> It did.

>> How did it work?

>> Because one, now I have to get up and actively be on social media.

>> Yeah.

>> This is my job.

>> Yeah.

>> But also, it gave me a sense of purpose

because laying in the bed in the fetal position was an option.

It's not the best option.

>> Yeah.

>> But to get up and put on a face and put on an outfit,

it it it is it is empowering.

As as corny as it may sound, as and it cost nothing,

but to go in your closet and pull out something and be like, "Okay."

And put it on and your kids saying, "Okay."

Or I FaceTime my daughter and she's like, "This is good.

The people will love this."

Helped me to keep going

because I just really like I had worked my entire life since I was

15 years old and to not have to get up

and go to work.

To succumb to that was easy.

>> Yeah.

>> But to get up and like put that on, >> Yeah. >> was good.

It really was good.

It helped me.

>> Do you think this is like a little bit of a tangent,

but do you think having your first daughter

so young has always changed your perception of your own age

or place in life?

>> Yes.

>> Because most women who have a 35-year-old daughter are going to be quite

a bit older than you.

>> Yes.